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Copyright RomanyGenes 2007-2020 Design and Web Layout S.J.Day All Rights Reserved
The Cooper family discussed in this article are often referred to as the "Windsor" Cooper's and have over the years produced as many new queries as it has solved !
The reason why I have over the years kept an eye on any new finds or clues to this family was because of a certain John Cooper with the nickname of "Stumpy" on account of his losing his right hand in an accident early in life and because I always felt he descended from the Windsor Cooper's and now thanks to the new DNA research available this has i think been proved thus he would be kin to the well known Mathias (Matty) Cooper born 1806 Cheltenham Gloucester and his possible baptism Parish Register.
"BAPTISMS solemnized in the Parish of: Cheltenham in the County of: Glouster
When Baptized: 1816 24th July
Child's Christian Nme: Mathias Son of
Parents Names: Henry & Mary White-Abode: Cheltenham
Quality, Trade or Profession: Tin Man
By whom the Ceremony was performed: Thos Blackman Newell
Note:***Several researchers agree that this is the baptism for Mathias Cooper however it is up to the individual to examine the facts and other Gloucestershire baptisms and reach their own conclusion."**
The White /Cooper connection is evident by the numerous baptism's found for the known Cooper's who also baptised under the White name , its quite common for the maiden name to be used or even a grandparent's, but is there a possibility it was White and not Cooper ? Just as many Hughes are also found using the name Cooper and vice versa! (This also happens with other family names) I have had the various records for many years but have never got around to looking into it further ).
From the same Cooper line are to be found as an example ,Sidney son of Elisha and Tryphena baptizing children under the White name . Sidney only appears a few times and among one of these is this entry for the poor house :-
Name: Sidney Cooper/Birth Date: about 1814--Admission Age: 41//Admission Date: 19 Nov 1855---Record Type: Admission/Borough: Tower Hamlets
Parish or Poor Law Union: Stepney--Title: Saint George in the East Workhouse: Admission and Discharge Register, 1854-1856
My friend Elizabeth Golding has also over the years recorded alot of information and kindly and most generously shared with me her gleanings over the years as has Mark Hughes and John Russell who have also for many years been researching and we have all shared what we have found some of which is as follows ,of course as with all family history as new records become available or are found the article will be added to and corrected whenever possible:- A few examples below of the nature of sharing info with fellow researchers how you can go back and forth many times before you get the end result (if ever)
(Just an example of sharing ideas before arriving at final conclusions or proof) :-
This just gives you an idea how research can change over a period of time and as new records come to light)
"Email from Betty"
If i remember rightly, in later census Eve is older, shes not as young as she says in the 1880 - Henry is the right age to be George, who was bapt 1815 at St Marys Lewisham Kent,Have to look up the later census as i know Eve is def older in those.
.So Elisha/Caroline who have Perrin on igi are the same as Elisha Defiance Frances Scamp ( i know you have said this before)
Old draki = Dukey
Dukey married Eliza Dawson not Ellis as i have their marriage (well not cert) and as the person states dawsons are next door (elizas parents and siblings)
There is a Susan or Susannah Cooper ,i know there was supposed to be a susan cooper who was an aunt to matty'Like the trinity lovell bit, quite possible, especially as Eisha supposedly from Warminster Wilts and they themselves have a trinity.
The Merrily Joles nee Cooper born about 1782, most prob the Morrely bapt Tetbury Glos daughter of Henry and Ciberena Cooper........ There has always been the Gloucestershire connection with my Coopers even up to now. Matty always says born Cheltenham even though i trudged through many registers at Cheltenham years ago and did not find a bapt for him there. I still have relatives now at Cheltenham. Mum and grandad used to travel from Belvedere pass Windsor, onto the Malvern Hills, Glos and then onto Wales.
"Elizabeth Golding "
Just looked, Merrily Cooper named a son Henry, so...........reckon that is her then, is that what you were thinking?I’m thinking that Henry and “Ciberina” Cooper are the same couple as Henry and Sabrina White that christen Penelope at Luckington (we have the image). I believe Penelope partners Righteous Lee and christens Pianna.))""
The baptism on te 24th July 1816 Cheltenham for a Matthias White to Henry and Mary white Tin Man we think is Matty Cooper. Of course we are always open to be corrected!
Site Owner:- So as you can see lots of loose ends to tie up! and as with all research its open to change as and when new info becomes available.There seems to be many links between the Dorset/Wilts and Hampshire Counties to the London/Windsor Coopers, very early records also add to the connections one such record being the baptism of Moses Small 23 Jun 1793 WINTERBORNE KINGSTON DORSET who partnered Cinderella Cooper born abt 1797 .
Another White connection to the Cooper family is the 1815* Settlement order, Boreham, Essex. Wandering and lodging in open air. Solomon about 25, Old Windsor, son of Elisha Cooper, rat catcher. Settlement Hayes, Kent where father comes from. Infant brother Dickie cooper about 8 years old. Travelling with Trinity Cooper d/o of Elisha Cooper, rat catcher, about 16, born Old Windsor. With them was Kissee White, about 27 born Oakenham, Berks. Kissee has two children under 10.
(I did at first think dickie was Duke but its also possibly short for Richard?)
Kissee mentioned above was in fact Keziah daughter of Henry White and Sybarina/ Cyprikana (or various spellings)
Records below :-
Name :Kezia White:Gender Female
Baptism/Christening Date 09 Oct 1785--Baptism/Christening Place WOKINGHAM,BERKSHIRE,
Father's Name :Henry White :Mother's Name :Syberana
Name:Seberina White**Departure Place:Bewley,(Think Beaulieu) Southampton
Destination Place:Child Okeford, Dorset
Event Date: 15 Apr 1785**Record Type:Vagrant Pass
Archive Description:Vagrants' Passes etc. Mar 1785 - Apr 1785 (Borough of Shaftesbury)
Persons on Form:*Name:Henry White--Seberina White his wife
Elepheletta White dau age abt 3
Marina White dau aged abt 2 ( I think this is Morella or Merrily who wed Isaac Joules)
(Parish Register, Tetbury, Gloucestershire, " Baptisms 1783 Morrely Dau of Henry & Ciberena Cooper Dec, 28th.
Surely connected as on the same day and place as the above (more research in progress) is :-
Name: Elepheletta Jones
Departure Place: Bewley, Southampton---Destination Place: Child Okeford, Dorset
Event Date: 15 Apr 1785
Record Type: Vagrant Pass Archive Description: Vagrants' Passes etc. Mar 1785 - Apr 1785 (Borough of Shaftesbury)Persons on Form: Name Elepheletta Jones.
Penelope White - International Genealogical Index *Gender: Female Christening: 21 APR 1782 Luckington, Wiltshire
FATHER*HENRY WHITE Mother: SABRINA
I believe the Syberina/Cyberina/Cyprikana..... was the Zebrina born abt 1761 and sister to Dove Herren/Hearne this again connects with Dorset and of course further connetions to the Stanley/Burton/Cooper/Joles/Broadway/Wharton etc a number of who emigrated to the USA ,as was often the case with Romany families at that time marrying their cousins thus many names getting repeated over generations etc.
Christening Date-Jul 1767.......Christening Place, IDMISTON, WILTSHIRE.
Father's Name::Robert Boswell::Mother's Name::Lucretia
(Is this the Lucretia and Robert named in the prison record along with Dove and Zebrinah Herne?)
Further White/Cooper/connections to the two names are Richard and Milly Cooper choosing to use both names in baptisms see below:-
Name:Talanty Cooper OR White/ Female/Birth Date: abt 1792.........Christening Date: 20 May 1792
Christening Place: Burbage, Wiltshire//Father's name: Richard Cooper or White....Mother's name:Milly
Name: Anslow Cooper/Gender: Male/Birth Date: abt 1797......Christening Date: 11 Jan 1797
Christening Place: Downton, Wiltshire//Father's name: Richard Cooper........Mother's name: Milly
Name:George Cooper/Baptism Date:14 Apr 1799/Baptism Place:Chiddingstone, Kent/Father:Richard Cooper-Mother:Milly
Name:Mary Cooper//Date:21 Aug 1803.....Baptism Place:Penshurst, Kent.............Father:Richard Cooper Mother Milly
Name:Alice Cooper/// Date:31 Mar 1805.....Baptism Place:Penshurst, Kent.........Father:Richard Cooper Mother:Milly
Its tempting to think Richard could be a brother to Elisha(Lusha)Cooper ? Also interestly he named a daughter Penelope .Another link is Leonard Cooper b 1806 son of Henry and Mary) Leonards daughter Mary partnered George White babt 1824 and they had a Richard born 1847 who partnered Theodosia Aryes.
It was Betty Golding who first sent this George White actually being born as George Cooper GEORGE COOPER**Christening:04 APR 1824 Upton Grey, Hampshire........ Parents:Mother: SARAH COOPER
Pitured left 15 Apr 1777
Event Place:Dorset, England
1851* Binfield, Berkshire
George White abt 1824 Nk, Hampshire, Head
Mary White abt 1828 Brading, BerkshireWife
Richard White abt 1848 N Son
Leonard Cooper abt 1807 Old Windsor Berks
Phillis Cooper abt 1811 Hampton, Surrey Wife
Nelson Cooper abt 1832 Trinley, Surrey Son
Thomas Cooper abt 1836 Chertsey, Surrey Son
George White abt 1824 Upongray, Hampshire Head
Mary White abt 1824 Abbifield, Berkshire, Wife
Richard White abt 1848 Tordle, Kent, Son
Sarah Cooper abt 1804 (mother)Chalgrove, Oxfordshire
On another article :-1823
Appeared in Union Hall Police court in August 1823 on a charge of vagrancy at Norwood:-
The arrest of several of the gypsies. Elisha Cooper wife Ann, Eve Cooper, Anne Marie Cooper, Saibriana Cooper and Jane Cooper were arrested, Those punished at House of Correction Brixton on 11th aug 1823 were Mary ann lee, Thomas cooper, Elisha cooper, Sophia lee, Hannah Cooper pretending to tell fortunes and Sabrina Cooper, all hard labour for one month (Article also said that all the people were all one family group)There are many more connections to yet tie up including the Scamp/Stanley and Lee families among others :- More to follow:-